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Nitro o Poly en stratos cabezonas? (o sea CBS)

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En varios lugares figura como polyester la terminación de las violas fender Strato (y supongo que las demás de la línea Fender) desde el 68 hasta que termina la etapa CBS.

Yo tuve el libro de Duchossoir de la Strato pero no lo puedo consultar más porque se lo presté a un alumno que no recuerdo quién es y no lo vi más :( . Qué mal ahí...

El tema viene por la viola de Ariel, que está reterminada en poly como es para la época. Yo tengo una Strato 72 que está terminada en nitro (el cuerpo y la pala del mango. El resto del mango es polyester claramente porque es bien transparente y duro). Entonces en qué quedamos? Hubo excepciones? Ponían lo que tenían ganas? Lo que les mandaba el mayorista? Mi viola es sunburst.

Además tengo un amigo luthier que me contó que tiene un bajo precision 78 termiando en nitro.

Juan tiene una tele CBS en mocha brown o algo similar en nitro.

Qué pasa acá? Alguien más puede aportar datos? Tanto de cuerpos en nitro como no? A ver si sacamos alguna conclusión.

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Yo creo que el sellador que usaban era siempre poliester, luego segun el color podrian cambiar el tipo de terminacion. Mi guitarra es nitro la pintura de la caja, esta toda cuarteada y no se despega, donde se despega se ve otra cosa que no es nitro (la nitro se une una capa con la otra),

la pala es nitro del lado del decal porque esta marron oscuro, el resto del mango tiene un color mas sintetico.

 

Saludos,

 

Juan.

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Extraído de http://www.provide.net/~cfh/fenderc.html (La mejor info acerca de pinturas Fender)

 

What Did Fender Use after Lacquer in 1968?

 

Bob Gowan ran the Fender finish shop for Leo Fender and for CBS until he got sick of CBS and quit in the early 1970s. It was the decision of Bob and another gentlemen at Fender in 1968 to change to Aliphatic Urethane Coatings (aka "Poly") on the guitars. Fender immediately went from numerous coat application of clearcoat lacquer to *two* coats of Aliphatic Urethane. The decision was strictly a labor thing, but in the process, the decision essentially ruined Fender instruments!

 

Also it should be noted that 1968 and later Fenders are not entirely AUC (Aliphatic Urethane Coating). What Fender did was seal the body (as always), and then spray the sunburst colors with lacquer. Now instead of using lacquer as the clear coat over the sunburst, they just sprayed two coats of AUC. Also the face of the peghead stayed entirely lacquer, even though the rest of the neck was spray with AUC. This happened because the peghead "Fender" decal reacted with AUC. The problem occured because in 1968 Fender now clearcoated *over* the peghead decal for the first time.

 

Esto significa que las Fender de 1968 en adelante, tienen la capa base de Fullerplast (polyester); luego la capa de color - Nitro - y arriba están selladas con varias capas de Poly. O sea, sería imposible que el nitro entrase en contacto con la humedad o el ambiente.

No existe ninguna Fender con pintura original que no sea POLY desde 1968. El Nitro era sólo la capa de color interna.

 

Aquí hay más info: http://caraguitars.com/fullerplast.asp

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Ariel,

 

En mi mocka brown (o el color que sea), si le paso un trapito con alcohol, se levanta la pintura, entonces es nitro, y es el clearcoat. Creeria que si aplicas otra cosa arriba de nitro, esta se remueve y el resultado puede ser raro.

 

Saludos,

Juan.

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Ariel,

 

En mi mocka brown (o el color que sea), si le paso un trapito con alcohol, se levanta la pintura, entonces es nitro, y es el clearcoat. Creeria que si aplicas otra cosa arriba de nitro, esta se remueve y el resultado puede ser raro.

 

Saludos,

Juan.

 

entonces no es original.

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entonces no es original.

 

O el texto que pusiste esta equivocado. Viendo la guitarra, el color es original, tiene todo el destaste natural,

 

Saludos,

Juan.

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entonces no es original.

 

O el texto que pusiste esta equivocado. Viendo la guitarra, el color es original, tiene todo el destaste natural,

 

Saludos,

Juan.

 

El libro de A.R: Duchossoir dice lo mismo. En muchos sitios muy serios de internet dice lo mismo. Los coleccionistas y especialistas dicen lo mismo. Tom Wheeler en American Guitars dice lo mismo.

Yo he visto varias Fender de los 60's y 70's y la Thick Skin era más que evidente.

No te confundas con la pintura con base de agua que usaron en 1979-1980 y se descascaraba.

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Yo le puedo llevar a cualquier especialista mi guitarra y dice que la pintura es original, despues le ponemos una gota de alcohol y lo disuelve, entonces es nitro. Quizas sea una excepcion.

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Viendo el link que pasaste, ese tipo reliquea o arruina lso instrumentos?

 

main.php?cmd=imageview&var1=Relic+Museum%2FNecks+Please%2F100_0031.jpg

main.php?cmd=imageview&var1=Relic+Museum%2FNecks+Please%2F100_0030.jpg

main.php?cmd=imageview&var1=Relic+Museum%2FNecks+Please%2F100_0030.jpg

 

Se pasa de calor, levanta los trastes, llevara a la panaderia de la esquina para que metan la viola adentro?

 

Saludos,

Juan.

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La información que sigue ha sido provista por Mark Kendrick, Master Luthier de Fender en los 90's y actualmente co-dueño de Tom Anderson Guitarworks

 

The first Fender lap steel was finished in black enamel. When Doc Kauffman and Leo formed K&F guitars in 1945, their original instruments, including the amplifiers, were finished in a lead based, wrinkle coat enamel. A nice shade of Battleship Grey. That was the only color available. After expermenting with different woods other than pine for guitars, they began using nitrocellulose lacquer. They used what was available to the furniture trade at the time.

The original colors were blonde, sunburst, etc... just like your Grandmas coffee table.

 

Custom colors were introduced in 1955. Once again they were enamel. The same material they used in the auto industry. The enamel would not adhere to the stearate based nitocellulose sanding sealer. Acrylic lacquers were then developed by Dupont to be sprayed on material other than metal. "Duco colors". In order for the paint to adhere, Fender began using a Sherwin Williams product called Homoclad. It was a penetrating, heavy solid, oil based sealer used as a barrier coat to to provide better adhesion for their guitars with custom colors. It was applied by dipping the guitar bodies directly into a 55 gallon drum, filled with the product. ALL Fender guitars produced after 1955 used this product until 1967, when Fender began experimenting with polyesters an undercoat.

 

By 1968, virtually all Fender guitar products used polyester as an undercoat, including necks. It's a two part product using Methyl Ethyl Ketone(MEK) as a catalyst. The reason the face of the pegheads were not sealed with polyester, is because type 'C' decals (under the finish) would not adhere to the product. While it is true a few guitars may have squeaked by with homoclad, when homoclad wasn't available, they used a Fuller O'Brian product called Ful-O-Plast. PLASTIC!!! It's obvious to me that those necks or bodies were stragglers, having to be reworked for some reason or another and not shipped after the change.

 

I'd like to make one thing clear... ALL FENDER GUITARS PRODUCED AFTER 1968 HAD A POLYESTER UNDERCOAT WITH A LACQUER COLOR COAT AND POLYESTER TOPCOAT!!! There is no specific ratio. Enough poly was, and is sprayed to properly fill the grain while preventig a burn through while sanding.

 

In 1983, Fender began using polyuerthane as a topcoat. It cured quicker. It had better clarity. It had more depth and gloss, and didn't melt when you accidently spilled 151 on it. Fender then discontinued the use of polyester on the necks. Polyurethane is a 2 part product using a catalyst.

 

Fender has continued to use polyester, polyurethane, nitro, homoclad, and Ful-O-Plast.

 

Nitro is not a superior finish. An electric guitar doesn't 'breathe' at 120 db.

 

My first year at Fender I personally painted approximately 46,000 guitars. I like polyester. I like Nitro colors too. But maybe I'll let the players that use poly (ester or urethane) speak for themselves...

 

Billy Gibbons, Geddy Lee, Alex Lifeson, Joe Perry, Jimi Hendrix, Eric Clapton, Roccco Prestia, Jimmie Vaughn, Nils Lofgren, Vince Gill, Chet Atkins, Tom Hamilton, Lenny Kravitz, Merle Haggard, Don Rich, Darryl Jones, Mike Stern, Larry Carlton, Peter Frampton, Sting, Marty Stuart, just to name a few. More are available upon request.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Mark Kendrick.

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Ariel,

 

Lo que dice Kendrik lo habia leido, yo te puedo asegurar que tengo una Fender Stratocaster 1972, para mi es color natural (se ve casi marron, pero al sacar el pickguard es casi transpartente), y es nitro. Si ves otras que son color natural, normalmente en ash (la mia es alder), son mas claras. Quizas sea una guitarra rara (vi una en Gbase igual a la mia), etc, pero es nitro, y no esta repintada.

 

De la misma forma te puedo decir que tengo una black que tiene por debajo sunburst todo original, seguramente en la epoca hacian cosas raras que no figuran en los libros.

 

Saludos,

Juan.

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Lo mismo pasa con la mía. Me doy cuenta que la pintura es la original. No sólo yo. Rudy, mi amigo luthier, me dice lo mismo. Y tiene todos los síntomas del nitro. Inclusive lo del alcohol que ya lo había probado abajo del pickguard. En fin, después posteo fotos BIEN de cerca.

Saludos

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